DA14580电源电压较高的通信问题 - 跟进

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mratajski
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DA14580电源电压较高的通信问题 - 跟进

我们在Pan1740模块上使用DA14580。
The module is used on a coin battery powered products.
在产品上,微控制器与UART的DA14580通信。

We are experiencing with some modules connection problems.
我们注意到,当电池电压较高的电池电压高于3.1V - 3.3V时,我们会发生这种情况。

This is new topic as I have further findings and question in previous one is 'completed'. I have received new units from production showing this problem.

我们的生产软件在没有任何问题的情况下运行,因为长电源电压低于3.25V。
With higher voltages it is running for a few seconds. I can see the product popping up in Windows Bluetooth pairing. If I am fast enough I can get PIN prompt. However I cannot complete pairing.

We have implemented basic support for RF Master (start/stop) for tests. It is possible to communicate with it over whole supply range (up to 3.6V).

To eliminate any possible mistake introduced by us, we used example application from SDK:
\ da1458x_sdk_5.0.4 \ da1458x_sdk \ 5.0.4 \ projects \ target_apps \ ble_examples \ prox_reporter \ keil_5 \ prox_reporter.uvprojx
It has been compiled without any modifications.
我可以看到蓝牙设备Dialog-PRXR.when I start the Bluetooth module on our device.
一切都很好,高达3.25V - 我可以看到该装置,我可以在Windows(没有PIN)中配对它。
As soon as I increase voltage to 3.3V it is running again for few seconds only - right after power on the device is popping up, but I cannot complete pairing.
该模块正在UART启动,没有任何问题到(至少)3.6V。

The Panasonic module (PAN1740) we are using has very little external components (inductor, two crystals and few capacitors).

Voltages mentioned are supplies of our product. The module is supplied through IO pin of a microcontroller, so actual voltage on the module is lower (around 50mV less).

问题仅显示了一些单位。其他人没有任何大惊小怪(配对和沟通),高达3.6V(更高:--))。

What could cause such behavior? Where should I search further?

Device:
PM_Dialog
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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

谢谢你的问题在线。是否有可能提供以下数据,以更好地了解您的问题?

  1. A current capture when the connection fails.I suspect that some of the devices miss connection events, so the connection cannot be maintained. What is the connection interval that you are using? If connection events are missing, then the connection interval should be gradually getting larger.
  2. A BLE Sniffer log when the connection fails.
  3. 故障设备正在进行时电流捕获。是you able to count the advertising events? Are you missing any of the advertising events?

Thanks, PM_Dialog

mratajski
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1.

1.
在安装后恰到好处的模块的附件电流消耗并在3.0V(OK),3.2V(OK)和3.3V(OK)和3.3V(IT失败)上进行启动。
初始化后,软件似乎是......

Connection interval is what prox_reporter BLE example has (min. 10ms, max. 20ms?).
However it depends on the negotiation with Windows 10 mostlikely - it has standard configuration.

2.
我们没有BLE Sniffer ......
Can you recommend one?

mratajski
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Current consumption of the

Current consumption of the module with changing voltage:

1. Module powered on and booted with 3.0V

2.供应短暂增加至3.3V

3. Supply reduced back to 3.0V

该模块无法以较低的电压恢复。

omesa
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hello,

hello,

maybe your problem is : " The module is supplied through IO pin of a microcontroller, so actual voltage on the module is lower (around 50mV less)."

cheers

Siegmar.

mratajski
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我已经硬连线了模块

我已经硬连线了模块到外部电源......没有运气......一旦电压为3.3V,就会停止......

omesa
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hmmh ..... what happend, when

hmmh ..... what happend, when your controller make with an Portpin RESET on the PAN1740 modul.

I have in my projekt the same module and mass production will start soon. My external controller can always RESET the modul. This is my hardware watchdog.

cheers

Siegmar.

mratajski
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With our host software we

使用我们的主机软件,我们一直检查与模块的通信。
If it stops to respond host makes reset of the module.
与lo模块供电w voltage is working fine and the reset would be used only in case when the module is really stuck - I have not observed it.
As soon as voltage increases I can observe endless loop of resets...
BLE处于活动状态几秒钟,然后重置又一次地重置......
Periods of activity are enough for Windows to detect the device, once or twice I could complete pairing, but you can forget any comunication...

However, there is no communication with Dialog API example application (proxy), so the reset functionality in host is dissabled.
当它被卡住时,它只是卡住了......

and once again - it is happening to only few units we have - all others are working fine up to 3.6V.
However this is affecting yield and extorts PCBA repairs...

cheers,
Michal

PM_Dialog
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嗨omesa,thanks for your

嗨omesa,thanks for your answer.

Hi mratajski, I’ll check your inputs and let you know as soon as possible.

Thanks, PM_Dialog

PM_Dialog
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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

Again thanks for your inputs. Please correct my if anything is wrong/missing and kindly provide some further inputs on this. Then, I will escalate all your inputs internally for further analysis.

发表描述:

  • Pan14580模块用于定制板
  • DA14580通过硬币电池电量供电
  • The issue is appeared only in some modules, not at all devices. Can you indicate that the issue exists only on some of them? Are there any device which running at 3.3V supply voltage?

When the supply voltage is at 3.3V:

  • 一些电路板,开始广告一段时间,然后不断重置。你怎么知道芯片进入无休止的重置循环?
  • BLE is active for few second, so are you able to connect?

Thanks, PM_Dialog

mratajski
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> PAN14580 module is used in

> Pan14580模块用于定制板
是的,它用于我们的BLE启用的产品。

> DA14580 is powered through a coin cell battery
Yes, it is supplied using Lithium coin primary cell battery on problematic products (initial voltage 3.2-3.4V, nominal voltage 3.0V).

>此问题仅在某些模块中出现,而不是所有设备。您是否可以表明该问题仅存在于其中的一些问题?是否有任何在3.3V电源电压下运行的设备?
我们不执行生产测试为3.3 v。我们just test every unit with fresh battery (voltage of the battery is tested to be at least 3.2V or more) at the end of production.
Some units (few percent) are failing final BLE communication test with fresh battery.
大多数产生的单位对电池的初始(更高)电压没有问题。
We do perform BLE tests of every PCBA at 3.0V as well. At this stage all units are communicating without any problems.

I have tested some failed samples from production - for them threshold voltage is around 3.25V. I observe problem above this voltage.
我也在测试了一些传递的样本 - 它们良好高达3.6V。

>一些电路板,开始广告一段时间,然后不断重置。
Yes, I can observe the correct name of the BLE device in Windows 10 Bluetooth pairing.

>你如何知道芯片输入一个无休止的重置循环?
I observe communication between host CPU and DA14580 with oscilloscope. I observe reset line as well.
The host application does not receive CTS from application running on DA14580 and it resets the Bluetooth module after time out – DA14580 is entering UART boot process, loads firmware and starts normal operation for few seconds and CTS is missing again...

> BLE很高的秒数,所以你能连接吗?
Among others I am able to read ADC converter values from DA14580 over the BLE from time to time (reset and ADC pooling loops are not synchronized),
when the problematic unit is supplied with 3.3V.
配对在测试前在3.0V下执行。

我设法使用3.3V供电的有问题单元对Windows 10中的蓝牙设备搭配一次或两次。

如果我增加有问题的单位的电压(如3.4V或3.5V),我会留下深刻的印象。

问候,
Michal

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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

Let me escalate your inputs internally. I’ll get back to you as soon as I have feedback from the Team.

Thanks, PM_Dialog

omesa
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Hi Michal

Hi Michal
“主机应用程序不会从DA14580上运行的应用程序接收CTS,并且在超时后重置蓝牙模块 - DA14580进入UART启动过程,加载固件并开始正常操作几秒钟,CTS再次缺少......”

发生了什么,当您的主机重置不是Pan1740时?它仍然活着和广告?
What kind of host you have ?
Maybe for testing the modul, you can put for example a tag firmware on it.
Another idea, maybe the CTS Signal is too short or the serial communication is failed.
What is your baudrate ? Is it protected my a checksum ?
对不起,这只是猜测,因为我们没有在我们面前的硬件。
cheers
Siegmar.

mratajski
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嗨omesa,

嗨omesa,

When CTS is missing, the DA14580 is not advertising anymore.
CTS pulses are long enough for the microcontroller. When application running on DA14580 is hanging it does not send CTS anymore (short or long - verified with oscilloscope).
The application is based on examples from SDK.

We have put proxy firmware (example from Dialog SDK without any modifications as I have mentioned before already) on the module as well.
电压较高相同 - 它是广告几秒钟,然后它停止。您可以通过当前绘制模块不再传输了。
This means very simple application (no communication with host at all) is hanging by itself when there is higher voltage present.

问候,
Michal

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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

我已经在内部升级了你的问题。我会及时通知你的。

Thanks, PM_Dialog

PM_Dialog
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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

Can you please change the BANDGAP_REG [LDO_RET_TRIM] bitfield to a lower value? The default value for DA14580 and SDK5.0.4 is 0x0A, so change it to 0x09. You can also refer to DA14580datasheet and Table 26: BANDGAP_REG (0x50000028) for more information. You will have to add the following line in the system_init() function before the periph_init() call.

void system_init(void) { ... // Check and read BD address nvds_read_bdaddr(); SetBits16(BANDGAP_REG, LDO_RET_TRIM, 0x9); //Peripherals initilization periph_init(); ... }

Thanks, PM_Dialog

mratajski
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Hi PM_Dialog,

Hi PM_Dialog,

It seems to be working! :-)
我收到了代理示例工作(我可以在Windows中配对)高达3.5V。
At 3.6V I cannot pair it as before.
I still need to do further measurements to be sure, but the question is: How low is reasonable to go with the bandgap voltage?
There is 3uH coil used (I will try to confirm it with Panasonic) as I have measured on other module.

Do you have any additional documentation for the register? TheTable 95: BANDGAP_REG (0x50000028)is not giving much details andNote 18is a little bit confusing...
What side effects are to be expected?

问候,
Michal

mratajski
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Hi PM_Dialog,

Hi PM_Dialog,

I have measured current consumption with bangap adjustments.
I have used simple scenario - read-out of battery voltage using ADC on DA14580 over Bluetooth, maintaining 3.0V voltage, so it works with and without modification.
Our product consumes on average around 1.2mA with default bandgap configuration and around 2.4mA with value set to 0x9...

So the fix helps with higher battery voltage (not entirely, but it is fine for us), but it doubles current consumption while Bluetooth is used...
这不是我们的目标......你有其他想法吗?

问候,
Michal

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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

是you using the same firmware with same advertising intervals? Did you test it with any of our SDK examples, such as ble_app_barebone? You mentioned that the battery voltage is 3.0V instead of 3.3V (which was the problem). Can you please clarify it?

Battery voltage = 3.0 Volt

- When BANDGAP_REG[LDO_RET_TRIM] = 0x0A, current consumption is 1.2mA

- 当BandGAP_REG [LDO_RET_TRIM] = 0x9时,电流消耗为2.4mA

Thanks, PM_Dialog

mratajski
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你好,

你好,

3.3V - voltage of fresh battery cell (sometimes it is higher)
3.0V - nominal voltage of the battery
Our product must work with both voltages.
Bluetooth is falling/hanging at 3.3V on some units (as I have already described).

I have performed current measurements at voltage keeping Bluetooth alive on all units. Just to be sure there are no other effects.

软件中唯一的区别是bandgap_reg [ldo_ret_trim]。所有其余的尚未触及(包括广告间隔)

BANDGAP_REG[LDO_RET_TRIM] = 0x0A ---> current consumption is 1.2mA
bandgap_reg [ldo_ret_trim] = 0x09 --->电流消耗为2.4ma

Current consumption is increased regardless of problems at 3.3V. Both "good" and "bad" units need more current.

I have attached current measurements of one unit with both settings.

问候,
Michal

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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

您能否请拒绝da1458x_stack_config.h标题文件中的cfg_power_optimizations宏?之后,您是否能够看到电源消耗的任何差异?

Thanks, PM_Dialog

mratajski
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Hi PM_Dialog,

Hi PM_Dialog,

谢谢你的新想法:-)
不幸的是我没有看到任何重要差异......平均只有15-29ua少... :-(

问候,
Michal

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Hi mratajski,

Hi mratajski,

我为迟到的回应道歉。实际上它是一个自定义PCB,有几个参数涉及并观察系统性能中的这种行为。例如,以下参数可能会影响系统:

  • XTAL cut
  • PCB层
  • PCB layout
  • Internal temperature
  • 定位的晶体
  • 对整体系统性能的影响

该分辨率是将LDO_RET_TRIM位字段更改为较低的值(如前所述),并将系统功能保持在已知的操作限制中。

Thanks, PM_Dialog

mratajski
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Hi PM_Dialog,

Hi PM_Dialog,

Thank you!
It seems I need to push module manufacturer now...

此致,
Michal